Did the US embassy over react by shutting down it's visa section under the Hubert regime back in 2009 when crime against tourists included at least one murder and the 'armed" robbery of 18 cruise passengers?

Where in the hell were The Tribune's "Shock" headlines when their red shirts PM and minister for the people's security were sitting on their hands whilst the thugs were robbing tourists and in broad daylight?

During that same 2009 period The Tribune reported 11 tourists were robbed in broad daylight at the Queen's Staircase.

Under the Hubert regime, tourists being robbed were not limited to 2009. They were robbed, assaulted and raped throughout the Hubert regime's 15 years in office.

There were also in 2009 a story about other tourists being robbed at gunpoint in our Bahamaland.

Bahamaland is not a nation of criminals running wild but a handful of thugs who PM Christie must do what his former law partner Hubert was incapable of doing. Reigning in this out of control small group who are out to instill fear in natives and tourist alike.

wasn,t it BJ that said the family members called and HAI mandatory sentences were too tough ,,

TalRussell never fails to absolutely amaze me!!!! What a STAUNCH PLP!!!!! Wow...... and that is not said with an admiring tone.

Sadly.........maybe by the time another election comes around no CRIME/Murder Bill boards will need to be errected..............all the toursits will already know............many having already personally experienced the violence.

Mr. PM I know: "it is what it is"

You're so mistaken. What makes you think you'd have to be a PLP to question an over reaction by the US Embassy. Yes, I am mad as hell that they would dare paint an entire nation with the same brush as a thug. It was so wrong a move to have taken.

Maybe it's time for ALL to put aside their political colours and begin an aggressive "Citizenry and Residents Proactive March" against the thugs. Guess what Comrades. Both the red and the gold shirts got's supporters who are either in prison as convicted thugs, or who should be locked-up in Fox Hill Prison.

Guess what. Before they pull back on the trigger they never ask for your political flavour, or if you're a native, resident or tourist. You have something they're too damn lazy to work to earn and they want it. Even if they have to kill you to get it.

Expand the powers of law enforcement agencies; create a separate branch of specialized officers call them Arms, Drugs and Corruption Unit; generate a Top 50 Most Wanted on a WEEKLY basis; give outstanding citizens extra-law enforcing powers to the extent of arms protection with the powers to shoot to kill; create a separate court for these cases and enact the Anti-Hooligan Law that allows for repeat offenders of violent crimes and gun possession to have their civil rights suspended and held indefinitely until such time the courts deems it suitable for release.

Wait. Which one is it? Were operations shutdown in response to violence in the country, or was the office unable to function without this person being present? One or the either. Which is it?

other*

I have never been the least interested in trashing the former PM but this story has one Comrade Chipman's name attached, who try as you may is a red shirt MP.

Where was Chipman's outraged voice when a Catholic Nun in 2010 was gang raped in Eleuthera? As long as nations have existed they have had to deal with crime. But to now pretend this is all new under PM Christie is beyond the absurd.

When they nailed Jesus to the Cross, he wasn't exactly in the company of saints. Now, was He?

Nobody suggests that crime started under Christie. The fact of the matter is that he promised to do something about it,and all we hear are slogans,urban renewal,swift justice,march against crime and so on. Talk won't solve crime,actions will.
All nations have to deal with different levels of crime. Is this an excuse to let it get out of control? May I remind you that not every nation depends on tourism like ours. So you may like or don't like foreigners(that's your business really),but whether you like it or not we depend on them for our prosperity.

what else will it happen???<img src="http://tinyurl.com/c7l9ck6" width="1">

It behooves the PM's followers who so blindly cling to his every word in the media since his government's involentary removal from office, all because of their deep haltered of PM Christie. Crime has now become their easy political target. Even if they have to destroy Bahamaland's reputation, if it can get them elected back into power. They are political scoundrels who dispute their massive rejection by the natives in 2012, are out to use their media friends, to "UNDO" the verdict of the natives. They think by destroying the reputation of Immigration Minister Fred, they can start with tarnishing those around the PM. They're not fooling anyone. Their real enemy target is PM Christie.

A word of caution. The numbers "bosses' and their high powered team of lawyers. tried that already. It ain't working its Mojo on PM Christie.

tals did not the plp put up billboards to hurt the fnm???

Anyone who persists in making this a PLP versus FNM issue is missing the point. This is a national crisis. There are emergency steps that can be taken to get this under control. So far the current government has done precisely NOTHING but jawbone. This is something that commands a "war footing" and should take precedence over every other one, of the many serious problems facing the Bahamas. There are a plethora of police experts who could be called in to recommend programs that could be initiated immediately to stop this wholesale crime wave in its tracks on an emergency basis. There are new laws required. We have a parliamentary system where the party in power can take those steps. There are no excuses. In the past this has been a difficult balancing act between individual liberty and civil rights on the one hand, and public safety on the other. It is no longer a cause for a balancing act. Public safety needs to be imposed whatever the temporary cost to our civil liberties or there will be no civil society left.

It is tragic that she was attacked, it should not of happened but how did the attack affect the U.S. visa service?

If the officer/diplomat had a case of influenza or some minor ailments and was not able to attend work would visa services have been disrupted?

Was the delay because the US visa service could not function without this individual? was there not anyone else to assist with the million dollar visa business which an individual pay fees with the chance of having your application denied?

We should not need a visa, we should be able to travel without all the red tape because 98% of Bahamian return back home or some never leave the island.

If they want to continue to help the Bahamas with policing and coast guard, OPBAT, etc.etc. make us a state or territory like the Virgin Islands, so their interest is kept and their investment is protected.

American criminals who have been convicted of crimes in the U.S. can travel to the Bahamas with no visa come here start a bar fight on Christmas drive down the center of the road on a moped and spend a night at central and come back next year for boxing day.

If we have such a close relationship and share so much there should be nothing hindering Bahamians from enjoying the same liberty and freedom Americans enjoy when they travel for years.

PS. Bahamian cant work or go to school commit minor traffic infractions without having an issues, they have boaters coming from Florida drinking and boating/driving, illegal fishing and get away with it, if a Bahamian does that in america they may not be ale to receive a visa for travel again.

Until then we are a still a part of The British Monarchy, and enjoy our commonwealth status, if my neighbor has a cow why go to the farm to get milk?

Getting a visa to enter the United States is a privilege, not a right. The Bahamas can deny entry to US criminals at the immigration checkpoints at the airports/seaports - they don't have a right to come to the Bahamas (unless, of course, they are Bahamians).

The US Embassy did not overreact. Crime in the Bahamas is out of control. And it is more than just a few thugs. Only when Bahamians are directly affected by crime (as with the cessation of visa services) does there seem to be an outcry.

And, don't believe the b.s. about the crime rate being a result of the US exporting all of these criminals once they get out of US jails. They are Bahamians that went to the US and committed crimes. Does anyone really expect the US to keep them there once the jail time is served? The US is just sending them back to where they came from; just as the Bahamas repatriates Haitians and others that have been in the Bahamas illegally for years.

It is time for politics to be put aside - the Bahamian tourism industry is in serious jeopardy and, more importantly, Bahamians do not deserve to have to live amidst the effects of such crime. Want better for yourselves, children and grandchildren.

@Aloethree, The tail is trying to wag the dog again...I am certain that if we closed our embassy in Washington, the citizens of the USA would not be in a tizzy, some might even be asking, "where's the Bahamas again?"
I am also 100% certain that operations "could" have gone on without the staff member present, the fact that they did not was a clear message to Perry Christie to get his house in order.

And you know what I believe he should do? ....I believe he should get his house and house members in order, rearrange house, clean house if he has to. actually just clean house.

Lamenting about how we is the big bad Bahamas does nothing but hurt us. We are a small island nation plain and simple.

First we cussed out Izmarillion, then we cussed out the foreign banks, now we want to cuss out the US. STOP IT.

FIX US!!!

So spot on.

I agree with the rearranging and following procedures and getting his house in order,
Im not glorifying the bahamas as being big and bad because it is out of style.
My point is that we should be more nationalistic and stand our grounds with immigration and the crime issue.

Im not saying to withdraw our diplomatic relations with the usa or that they should do the same, but the point is the issue is being politicized.

You have to stand for something or you fall for anything, If not they will dictate to the Bahamas entirely with no benefits for the people.

And we are an Island but also a member of The Commonwealth Realm,
then i hear these same wolves in sheeps clothing crying for us to become a republic, how and for what? this country belongs to the Crown.

well put !!@thisisours

As long as you think it's a matter best left to the policeman's, crime will intensify. The Hubert regime spent millions on increased policing, equipment and increased fire power and the thugs went out and bought equally or greater high powered machine guns. So long as you believe we can leave it up to the outside experts, crime will continue as a growth industry.

First, we need to rid our courts of inept, lazy for justice judges and hire an all new set of judges. Then we MUST treat and stop sending drug users and family dispute defendants to prison. Fox Hill is overcrowded with poor, young black natives, mostly male.

Forget the cries for bringing back the hooded-hangman. It didn't work defectively before under the UBP, PLP or FNM.

Some have even gone as far as to call for a show of armed policeman's force in tourist frequented areas? still you can't have armed policeman's around your residence or business 24/7. Neither can tourists hotel rooms be armed protected 24/7?

Your absolutely right, entering or getting a US visa is a privilege, The same can be said about the Bahamas.

Who are really the ones that truly enjoy such privilege?

Crime does exist worldwide, one can travel to the USA and experience racism from the server at McDonald's to an officer of the local police.

On several holiday periods there were reports that Bahamians were being targeted and victims of theft while shopping in South Florida, it would not be fair to say that Bahamians should not travel to shop in The US based solely on what happened.

Bahamian business persons are swindled all the time in the US if they are not sharp enough. Before you go if your caught with your $6,000 asue draw and your with 2 of your friends who have $5,000 each your funds are confiscated.

The Bahamas is one of or if the most successful independent countries ruled by the majority of Black/ African descent and i do believed we are envied and are becoming targets.Is It because we have become educated as blacks and run our economy and make are own deals to buy from China or Canada? Or develop our oil field which has oil in abundance?

We do have crime such as anywhere else, lets make it a better Bahamas and use our neighbors immigration practices where we protect our air/sea ports and keep undesirable foreigners from disturbing/influencing our quaint and peaceful people n country we call home and paradise lets get better for our selves and grandchildren.

Tourism is good but lets do manufacturing lets use BISX, recycling,farming,lets do some exports lets do some oil digging get rid or limit the Foreign Direct Investments.

Get jobs for Bahamians and continue to educate our people.

Bahamians in general love the USA and like to travel however in most cases its just a few who make the experience bad on both ends.

another thing is now we have Bahamians who are not Bahamians, they either bought their citizenship or gained it but do not share the view or beliefs of our forefathers you cant change what Lynden Pindling and others started which is in the Constitution, if you changed the foundations of the Bahamas we just wont simply be able to call it the Bahamas, our founding fathers created this country for us to enjoy we can not change that or allow foreigners who bought or stole their right to change that lest we become lost.

http://www.bahamas.gov.bs/wps/portal/pu…

Chile please...you don't need to look at people who bought their citizenship to find Bahamians who don't share love of country as did our forefathers.

You gat a bunch of them sitting in a big building on Bay Street for much of the year. They are out for themselves and their friends and they have told us so many times over in less than 1 year. They do **not** love this country

the U/S homocide rate is 4 per 100,000 ,,ours is 26 per 100,00 ,,we got a big problem @aloetree,,,,U/S BASHING MAY BE A BALM FOR YOU BUT IT WON,T CHANGE FACTS

Im not bashing anything it would be ludicrous for me to say that we dont have crime, corruption etc, my point is that what are we doing about it? Things that are widely pratices in the bahamas is corrupt or crime it starts from there wear your seat belt, pay your customs duty, don't hire your cousin to fill a job post, it starts from there give that fatherless child an opportunity to work, treat everyone fair educate the disadvantaged and impoverished give to charity, help your community

Please, the Bahamas/Bahamians are not being targeted b/c of envy. Most south Floridians can't even recognize a Bahamian accent. And, run our economy? Subsist on our own oil? What dream world are you in? We are so dependent that we can't even feed ourselves, importing 70% of our own food. I swear, if there's one problem we as Bahamians have it's that we're too proud and arrogant to recognize and admit that we have problems.

AND if we did grow our own food we would have to import all the fertilizers and farm equipment ,also the gov needs the revenue from imports

Ok so farm equipment tractors,backhoes etc, we import many countries do that it ok, we can get that from Brazil, china, Canada, Japan or the USA.

Fertilizer can be naturally made we have many chemist in the Bahamas some who went to C.O.B. and abroad

Lets say China, and we are able to work with a Chinese manufacturing/farming company to invest equipment(China is looking to invest/we build a stadium why?) and on 10,000 acres of crown land build a chicken farm that can supply enough produce to feed 20,000,000 people, create thousands of jobs for Bahamians its that simple.

Why did we build a stadium?

It seems like people lack the vision here in The Bahamas

Is there a market for poultry imports in Asia? I hear Asians will pay top dollar for certain fish and also have a reputation for overfishing to feed the high demand....I've yet to hear about chickens being endangered....

A small price to pay compared to what we already pay for imports. Also, you don't get revenue from imports. That's EXPORTS my dear.

I do not think you are a Bahamian, a Bahamian would not say that, who cares if Floridians or Americans dont know where or how a Bahamian talks, its not the point i'm making the Bahamas can be independent we do manage our economy and oil fields why because we are Black there are many educated and technically trained Bahamians here who can do the job.We have to be proud but the only one who sounds arrogant is yourself a little ignorant too if i may add.

Fortunately/unfortunately we live in a free country and a Bahamian can say anything they want to say. You will have to look for some other criteria on which to spread jingoistic rhetoric.

We are creeping dangerously towards a 70% debt to GDP ratio. I'm not an economist but I know enough to know that this is crisis time. I am not suggesting that some other country does the job for us, but I would not take our history as evidence of how good a job we are capable of in the future.

Which oil fields have we ever managed? Do you think you could get a team of Bahamians to plug a ruptured oil well 1600ft under water?

Look reality in the face. You have fine notions about how far Bahamians go can go. But to get **anywhere** you have to be brutally honest about where you are.

also aloetree we have been trying to farm these coral rocks since the loyalist and they nearly starved ..have you ever heard of economy of scale ,,you can grow better tomatoes on the volcanic islands to the south ,ship them to the U/S and then here cheaper then you can produce them on coral rock in any large amounts , second whos going to work these smelly chicken farms ,certainly not the kids we are graduateing ,,farming is like fishing it has to be in your blood ,or our you prepared to let in thousand low wage farm workers ,,now to oil ,,we have yet to find any ,but BPC keeps pumping up the talk to make money on the london board ,,,

Thank you ThisisOurs! aloethree needs to stop labeling brutal honesty as arrogance.

We won't advance if we can't acknowledge our problems first. It's no secret that the average Bahamian "skilled worker" is far behind those in other countries. It's a fact. Let's acknowledge and shift our efforts to rectifying this.

Pot calling the kettle black my dear. And why would a non-Bahamian be reading the Tribune? It's hardly a source of major global news. You should check your facts. We are light years behind other countries in terms of agricultural output.

Pot calling the kettle black my dear. And why would a non-Bahamian be reading the Tribune? It's hardly a source of major global news. You should check your facts. We are light years behind other countries in terms of agricultural output.

Hey the constitution is there if you believe that and its found to be true the can be removed their ***job*** is not indispensable as they are hired by the majority of the citizens of the Bahamas. Hey the constitution is there if you believe that and its found to be true the can be removed their ***job*** is not indispensable as they are hired by the majority of the citizens of the Bahamas.

Proudloudandfnm
It should be your concern as well, because it can affect your business on the family island, how do you get your fuel,food,money Nassau is the central your not aside from being a grand Bahamian, Abaconian, Family Islander,and so on you are a CITIZEN OF THE BAHAMAS, when you guys get a hurricane or the Mail Boats dont arrive on time, or lose jobs I dont say ohh its not my concern there not Nassuvians

Proud and Loud, careful...it always gives me a chill when I hear statements like that. I heard an expat say just yesterday, *you know once upon a time it was just over the hill, now nowhere is safe*,.... and that is the danger, we slept when we should have been working. When we should have been telling young men to work hard for what they got, we were busy taking money from Noriega and glorifying gangs at political rallies. This virus is growing and seeping into all corners of, yes, Nassau...don't make the mistake that it can't spread further....

That is nothing more than propaganda, first the statements were made that it was over the hill now they are claiming Nassau, this is so political wow...I've traveled and talked to many people that were surprised of what we have here this is a great country, you have certain powers that can not impose or dictate their systematic beliefs here in the Bahamas so they spread their propaganda, we Bahamians are diplomatic, democratic value God and have high morals, have you gone or driven into the Over the Hill, Coconut groove area most of those ppl are 2nd generation immigrants who have went through the system and have no documents, either both parents or a single are foreign to this country

*Value God and have high morales*? Which Bahamas you livin in, cause I want to move there. I have 2 words for you "Randy Fraser". We **mock** God with our fake *religiousity*

It was not *me* who made the *over the hill* comment, I was pointing out how dangerous statements like that are.

For Gods sake stop blaming other people for what's wrong with us. Yes I have driven over the hill, I do so quite frequently, guess what, the residents look just like me, and you I would suspect. Their kids are graduating with A's while our true true Bahamians are leaving as dumb as a door nail. Maybe **we** could learn a thing or two from them!

well put @thisisours

LOL

So does Randy Fraser represent the entire Bahamas and christian community?

Yes the over the hill statements are dangerous and wrong to make.
Yes they look just like me and you they are humans and Im sure most of them are not delinquents and excel in school, now your putting Bahamians youths down by saying they are dumb have you ever attended a public school?

If most of the teachers do their jobs they would not be dummy's and i know this because i attended a public school and i had teachers not show up for class and just did not teach classes but i still learned and i payed for my education most did not have the privilege i did they are not dumb the just never received adequate development from the educational system.

Randy Fraser is a fine representative of a wider problem that we have in the country. Everybody wants to call on God's name when they're in trouble, but when they're makin trouble they forget all about him. So to talk about our *valuing God* is the thing you should be laughing at.

I suppose the teachers are responsible for whats wrong with us now? And yes I attended public school, but I like you took responsibility for my own actions. 3 more words, national D-average. What else?

we go on about our forefathers and values ,,which ones the ones in africa that killed millions supplying the slave trade in tribal war , or the ones here that ran the civil war blockade ,or the ones that ran rum ,or when the columbians bought our whole damm goverment ,,,which forefathers ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

The ones that created the constitution of the commonwealth of the Bahamas in 1973

ohh the ones the columbians bought in the eighties , and please don,t say they didn,t i was involved before i changed my ways,,,,,,,,,niether PGC or HAI can solve crime ,,its a numbers game ,,as long as we produce more fatherless children than our gdp growth can absorb ,and now that we can no longer keep putting them on the civil service w/ out taxing everyone else to death and making our tourism product too expensive ,,,,crime will continue to increase ,ie haiti ,jamaica ,,we will end up like them with walled off resorts not open to the public and large slums and crime ,,

The Colombians bought permission of use of our resources and paid a tax can you 100% say that Sir Lyden Pindling and the then PLP was directly involved in the the drug trafficking? Did you see them moving bricks? Who really controlled the trade in the 80's

You cant produce a fatherless child and that has nothing to do with it, what civil service do they receive? i see these kids with nothing and parents also.

Sound's like you would want it to become like Haiti or Jamaica why not adopt and mentor a child, volunteer your time to an after school program.

Or a sex ed class, or get the garbage trucks to pick up the trash regularly so that it would not become a slum. and tell teachers to teach in public schools...come on..Are you apart of the cure or problem?

there was virtually and rug laws established in the 80's as it related to import/export the act was commenced on December 29th 2000 as listed on the Dangerous act laws. Check the books

i can directly say who we paid and who collected from us ,,i don,t need to chk any books ,,i lived it and know who collected the money and unleased the police if we didn,t pay ..too much to talk here ,but you believe what you like ..

Im saying check the books on the creation of the drug laws, if you have an apartment for rent and a tenant comes with cash willing to pay the year in advanced what would you do if you need to pay your bills?

ping ,bannister, et all didn,t need cash to pay their bills , it was greed ,,i was there and in it ,,remember HAI ,PGC LEFT ,,,I KNOW WHOES HANDS WE PUT THE MONEY IN ,,NONE OF THEM DID IT OUT OF NEED ,,SHIT WE EVEN CALLED TO BUY A LOAD THE DEFENCE FORCE GOT BACK ,,

I raised my 2 kids ,,the court on the family island i live spends 80% of its time chasing the dead beat dads for child support and the other 20% locking up their offspring for theft and violence ..we have been aborbing our irresponsible sexual habits ,single mother of 6 w/ three different baby daddy ,through an ever more bloated civil service and goverment borrowing ,,simply put we make babies faster than the economy can provide jobs ,,

Did the bastards come from bastards, it sounds like you are a parent have you or the other parent neglected/evaded responsibilities of providing for your children ? were you married?

Wont miss it till its gone

Wake up Bahamians!
The government can only do so much - the police can only do so much!
Change starts at home. When I was growing up "it took a village to raise a child"
We did not get what we wanted but what we needed and if we did get "extra" it was because we earned it.
Now "parents" just give their children everything and figure their job is done. My parents, as did many, knew where I was, what I was doing and who I was associating with at all times.
They took the time to talk with me and my siblings.
Now you have parents and grandparents excusing their children/grandchildren for all of the things that they are doing. Accepting the fruits of the crimes they are committing and covering up for them.
Wake up!!!! Stop blaming it on the government, the police and the teachers!!
"IT STARTS AT HOME"!!

well put !!