"the government is going by the results of the referendum they are not regulating or taxing the web cafe and there is no national lottery the problem is it looks like no one who voted understood the questions is this a result of the "D" average"
@ Larry
I will be honest Larry, I have read many of the other responses to this article but Larry, you smashed the nail on the head as you could not have said it any better. What's more amazing is the many persons who went to the polls to vote "No" without realising that to "Regulate" and to "Tax" is not the same as to "Legalize".
" If one is that addicted to gambling that they must break the law or circumvent the law to do so, they need some help - but they could also protest to make it legal."
Again, the fact is the lottery & gaming act which was created in 1969 was created at a time when the internet never existed. Again, numerous amendments were made since the time the act was created but to present, no bill was created to address internet gaming! Horse Racing has been address, Operating an Analog Casino has been address however Digital Gaming has yet to be address.
I will 100% retract everything I have said if you rory can provide 100% certified proof that Internet Gaming, that Digital Casinos, that playing on an Website that offers gaming is “Illegal” for “Bahamians”!
"As long as you placed that bet from your computer here in the Bahamas, then you are gambling in the Bahamas. And there are foot prints of your activity everywhere, plain & simple."
Lol, rory, the internet is not limited to the Bahamas! Many have the ability to use the internet with an in-accurate IP address that is intentionally made in-accurate. Many have the ability to use their smart phone from their yacht west of Bimini and east of Florida to access any website they please. In fact, the US Government and the Bahamian Government have yet to agree on exactly where the US/Bahamian border is which will be addressed but how do you propose preventing any person whether in the Bahamas or not from accessing the web (& to be more specific, a Gaming Website) from their PC, Laptop, Smart Phone etc? No supposing! No pretending! No Trick Word! How will it be done rory?
“Their attorneys are stupid and so are the cops, they could easily get them shut down, legally. The trick word is "online" - you are never "just" online. So simply forget the Internet even exists, they have footprints of their local crime everywhere”
Key words that you used which prove my point even further: Trick Word & Online. Its not a trick rory, its real, its not something we can “Simply Forget That Exists” the fact is Legislation must be created to address the Internet in the Bahamas as it relates to Gaming.
As it relates to the non-Binding Opinion Poll held last January!
Webshops are already regulated & taxed one the same manner as every other business that has a licence who provides online services.
Business license fees, NIB and all others taxes/utilities are all the same, that is fact!
Again Bahamians, you did not vote to either “Legalize Web” Shop Gaming or to make it “Illegal”, No you did not!
You voted to either have the Web Shops “TAXED” and to be “regularized” aka Regulated which means to conform as one eg Same Pay Outs, same games offered, same uniforms, same policies etc in the same manner in which the analog casinos in the Bahamas are presently regulated and taxed.
Go back and read the questions clearly!
You (the Vote No voters) said “NO” Government, we do not want you to tax the webshops, we want them to operate tax free which is the reason why they will not have to pay “value added tax” (vat) and you also said “NO” government, we want the web shop owners to decide as they please what their payouts can be, what their own policies can be, they do not need to have union representation, they can operate at what ever hours they please, there are no age requirements on who can play online, they can make their own policies even though every analog casino (who is presenently “taxed” & “regulated”) all have to act on one accord based on gaming board regulations by following the same regulations and pay the same taxes.
2) Do you really think the digital Casinos aka Webshops want to be taxed like the analog Casinos? Really?
3) Do you really think the digital Casinos aka Webshops want to be “Regularized” and not have the 100% freedom which they presently do to decide on their own what their terms, conditions & payouts would be as they please like how the analog Casinos? Really?
4) Fact, the Webshop owners wanted the “No” vote and those who were all around town promoting a “No” vote did exactly what the web shop owners wanted them to do whether they realized it or not because again, who in their right mind would not want to have the freedom to run their business as they please and most importantly, which business owner would want to be taxed?
Bahamians, wake up, educate yourself, the Government wanted the “Yes” vote, the webshop owners wanted the “No” vote.
Why?
Obtaining a license to open up a Web Shop is presently legal!
Any business with a license can allow their customers to open an account for debits/credits! What happens online in ca, il, ny, fl, la, Isle of Man or any country outside the Bahamas cannot be policed by Bahamian authorities but rather only by the authorities in those locations the same way those authorities have no jurisdiction in the Bahamas.
Either all adults can gamble straight across the board or no adult can gamble straight across the board in the Bahamas, plain & simple!
In addition, do you really want to know why 39 newly register Web Shop licenses in New Providence alone have been approved during the past year after the non-Constitutional Opinion Poll where many people incorrectly call a Referendum?
There is no law in the Bahamas Lottery & Gaming Act Chaper 387 that address gaming online aka web shop gambling.
Until such time therein, the Prime Minister, the Minister of Tourism, the Police Commissioner, the Attorney General and the Courts cannot arrest/charge/convict any Bahamian or Tourist on a crime in which there is no law to arrest/charge/convict them with.
That is fact.
The present attorney’s who are aware of this fact that are presently representing the web shop owners in court know they have a clear cut case because like them, myself and many others who fully read and understand the Lottery & Gaming Act know this. At the end of the day, until a law is created to directly address Internet Gaming in the Bahamas, we will continue to remain in this conundrum.
In lieu of your above comments especially with this one you stated:
“Everyone knows, Minister, that there is a heavy use of marijuana - a major underground trade with known confiscations of the drug of street values in the millions - so using Minister Wilchcombe’s argument the government should make the marijuana business legal!”
in the bahamas in the year 2014:
1) marijuana = illegal for tourists and bahamians all ages.
2) cocaine = illegal for tourists and bahamians all ages.
3) molly = illegal for tourists and bahamians all ages.
4) running the red light = illegal for tourists and bahamians all ages.
5) rape = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
6) murder = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
7) armed robbery = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
8) stealing = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
9) fraud = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
10) littering = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
when it comes to gambling in the bahamas:
1) legal for tourists 18years and older
2) illegal for bahamians all ages
how marcell can you compare a crime that is clearly illegal for all with an activity that is legal for some solely because of their age and immigrant status while on the other hand illegal for others because of their immigrant status regardless of their age?
either you allow all adults 18 years and older to gamble straight across the board in the bahamas as tourists 18 and older presently do or you don’t straight across the board and which government do you really think will shut down the casinos over pi, cable beach, exuma, bimini! really?
1) Bahamians, you did not vote to Legalize Web Shop Gaming, you did not! you voted to either have the Web Shops Taxed” & to be “Regularized” which means to conform as one eg Same Pay Outs, same games offered, same uniforms, same policies etc.
You instead said no Government, we do not want you to tax the webshops, we want them to operate tax free which is the reason why they will not have to pay value added tax (vat) and you also said not government, we want the web shop owners to decide as they please what their payouts can be, what their own policies can be, they do not need to have union representation, they can operate at what ever hours they please, they can make their own policies whereas the casino have to all act on one accord, that’s what you voted no for!
2) Do you really think the Webshops want to be taxed? Really?
3) Do you really think the Webshops want to be “Regularized” and not have the 100% freedom which they presently do to decide on their own what their terms, conditions & payouts would be as they please? Really?
4) Fact, the Webshop owners wanted the “No” vote and those who were all around town promoting a “No” vote did exactly what the web shop owners wanted them to do whether they realized it or not because again, who in their right mind would not want to have the freedom to run their business as they please and most importantly, which business owner would want to be taxed?
Bahamians, wake up, educate yourself, the Government wanted the “Yes” vote, the webshop owners wanted the “No” vote.
Why?
Obtaining a license to open up a Web Shop is presently legal!
Any business with a license can allow their customers to open an account for debits/credits! What happens online in ca, il, ny, fl, la, Isle of Man or any country outside the Bahamas cannot be policed by Bahamian authorities but rather only by the authorities in those locations the same way those authorities have no jurisdiction in the Bahamas. If I as a business owner said:
Hey Rory, since you have an online account in my business with $10, tonight if the Miami Heat scores 109 and the New Orleans Pelicans score five points or higher (114 points or higher), I will give you $50 but if New Orleans scores 113 or less, I will keep your money, how can the Police arrest me and/or you Rory?
bahamapride, excellent feedback. As it relates to you below statement:
The webb shop owners are in violation of the laws!
Notice what you said, not the illegal analog casino with slot machines, tables with dealers that are not approved by the gaming board, you said:
The webb shop owners are in violation of the laws
Do you really want to know why 39 newly register Web Shop licenses in New Providence alone have been approved during the past year after the non-Constitutional Opinion Poll where many people incorrectly call a Referendum?
There is no law in the Bahamas Lottery & Gaming Act Chaper 387 that address gaming online aka web shop gambling.
Until such time therein, the Police Commissioner, the Attorney General and the Courts cannot arrest/charge/convict any Bahamian or Tourist on a crime in which there is no law to arrest/charge/convict them with.
That is fact.
The present attorney’s who are aware of this fact that are presently representing the web shop owners in court know they have a clear cut case because like them, myself and many others who fully read and understand the Lottery & Gaming Act know this.
At the end of the day, until a law is created to directly address Internet Gaming in the Bahamas, we will continue to remain in this conundrum.
ChrisRolle says...
"the government is going by the results of the referendum they are not regulating or taxing the web cafe and there is no national lottery the problem is it looks like no one who voted understood the questions is this a result of the "D" average"
@ Larry
I will be honest Larry, I have read many of the other responses to this article but Larry, you smashed the nail on the head as you could not have said it any better.
What's more amazing is the many persons who went to the polls to vote "No" without realising that to "Regulate" and to "Tax" is not the same as to "Legalize".
Its truly unbelievable!
On PASTOR: WEB SHOPS ARE 'RAPING FAMILIES'
Posted 30 January 2014, 1:51 p.m. Suggest removal
ChrisRolle says...
@rory
" If one is that addicted to gambling that they must break the law or circumvent the law to do so, they need some help - but they could also protest to make it legal."
Again, the fact is the lottery & gaming act which was created in 1969 was created at a time when the internet never existed. Again, numerous amendments were made since the time the act was created but to present, no bill was created to address internet gaming! Horse Racing has been address, Operating an Analog Casino has been address however Digital Gaming has yet to be address.
I will 100% retract everything I have said if you rory can provide 100% certified proof that Internet Gaming, that Digital Casinos, that playing on an Website that offers gaming is “Illegal” for “Bahamians”!
I challenge you rory?
On Web shops and gambling
Posted 15 January 2014, 4:31 p.m. Suggest removal
ChrisRolle says...
@rory
"As long as you placed that bet from your computer here in the Bahamas, then you are gambling in the Bahamas. And there are foot prints of your activity everywhere, plain & simple."
Lol, rory, the internet is not limited to the Bahamas! Many have the ability to use the internet with an in-accurate IP address that is intentionally made in-accurate. Many have the ability to use their smart phone from their yacht west of Bimini and east of Florida to access any website they please. In fact, the US Government and the Bahamian Government have yet to agree on exactly where the US/Bahamian border is which will be addressed but how do you propose preventing any person whether in the Bahamas or not from accessing the web (& to be more specific, a Gaming Website) from their PC, Laptop, Smart Phone etc? No supposing! No pretending! No Trick Word! How will it be done rory?
On Web shops and gambling
Posted 15 January 2014, 4:28 p.m. Suggest removal
ChrisRolle says...
@rory
“Their attorneys are stupid and so are the cops, they could easily get them shut down, legally. The trick word is "online" - you are never "just" online. So simply forget the Internet even exists, they have footprints of their local crime everywhere”
Key words that you used which prove my point even further: Trick Word & Online.
Its not a trick rory, its real, its not something we can “Simply Forget That Exists” the fact is Legislation must be created to address the Internet in the Bahamas as it relates to Gaming.
The fact is it does not exists.
On Web shops and gambling
Posted 15 January 2014, 4:27 p.m. Suggest removal
ChrisRolle says...
@rory
“Addicted to gambling?”
No, addicted to the message of a man/woman being judged by their character rather than by their nationality!
On Web shops and gambling
Posted 15 January 2014, 4:27 p.m. Suggest removal
ChrisRolle says...
As it relates to the non-Binding Opinion Poll held last January!
Webshops are already regulated & taxed one the same manner as every other business that has a licence who provides online services.
Business license fees, NIB and all others taxes/utilities are all the same, that is fact!
Again Bahamians, you did not vote to either “Legalize Web” Shop Gaming or to make it “Illegal”, No you did not!
You voted to either have the Web Shops “TAXED” and to be “regularized” aka Regulated which means to conform as one eg Same Pay Outs, same games offered, same uniforms, same policies etc in the same manner in which the analog casinos in the Bahamas are presently regulated and taxed.
Go back and read the questions clearly!
You (the Vote No voters) said “NO” Government, we do not want you to tax the webshops, we want them to operate tax free which is the reason why they will not have to pay “value added tax” (vat) and you also said “NO” government, we want the web shop owners to decide as they please what their payouts can be, what their own policies can be, they do not need to have union representation, they can operate at what ever hours they please, there are no age requirements on who can play online, they can make their own policies even though every analog casino (who is presenently “taxed” & “regulated”) all have to act on one accord based on gaming board regulations by following the same regulations and pay the same taxes.
2) Do you really think the digital Casinos aka Webshops want to be taxed like the analog Casinos? Really?
3) Do you really think the digital Casinos aka Webshops want to be “Regularized” and not have the 100% freedom which they presently do to decide on their own what their terms, conditions & payouts would be as they please like how the analog Casinos? Really?
4) Fact, the Webshop owners wanted the “No” vote and those who were all around town promoting a “No” vote did exactly what the web shop owners wanted them to do whether they realized it or not because again, who in their right mind would not want to have the freedom to run their business as they please and most importantly, which business owner would want to be taxed?
Bahamians, wake up, educate yourself, the Government wanted the “Yes” vote, the webshop owners wanted the “No” vote.
Why?
Obtaining a license to open up a Web Shop is presently legal!
Any business with a license can allow their customers to open an account for debits/credits! What happens online in ca, il, ny, fl, la, Isle of Man or any country outside the Bahamas cannot be policed by Bahamian authorities but rather only by the authorities in those locations the same way those authorities have no jurisdiction in the Bahamas.
Either all adults can gamble straight across the board or no adult can gamble straight across the board in the Bahamas, plain & simple!
On Web shops and gambling
Posted 9 January 2014, 2:27 p.m. Suggest removal
ChrisRolle says...
In addition, do you really want to know why 39 newly register Web Shop licenses in New Providence alone have been approved during the past year after the non-Constitutional Opinion Poll where many people incorrectly call a Referendum?
There is no law in the Bahamas Lottery & Gaming Act Chaper 387 that address gaming online aka web shop gambling.
Until such time therein, the Prime Minister, the Minister of Tourism, the Police Commissioner, the Attorney General and the Courts cannot arrest/charge/convict any Bahamian or Tourist on a crime in which there is no law to arrest/charge/convict them with.
That is fact.
The present attorney’s who are aware of this fact that are presently representing the web shop owners in court know they have a clear cut case because like them, myself and many others who fully read and understand the Lottery & Gaming Act know this.
At the end of the day, until a law is created to directly address Internet Gaming in the Bahamas, we will continue to remain in this conundrum.
On Web shops and gambling
Posted 9 January 2014, 2:26 p.m. Suggest removal
ChrisRolle says...
Response to marcell hield,
Dear Marcell Hield,
In lieu of your above comments especially with this one you stated:
“Everyone knows, Minister, that there is a heavy use of marijuana - a major underground trade with known confiscations of the drug of street values in the millions - so using Minister Wilchcombe’s argument the government should make the marijuana business legal!”
in the bahamas in the year 2014:
1) marijuana = illegal for tourists and bahamians all ages.
2) cocaine = illegal for tourists and bahamians all ages.
3) molly = illegal for tourists and bahamians all ages.
4) running the red light = illegal for tourists and bahamians all ages.
5) rape = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
6) murder = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
7) armed robbery = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
8) stealing = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
9) fraud = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
10) littering = illegal for bahamians and tourists all ages.
when it comes to gambling in the bahamas:
1) legal for tourists 18years and older
2) illegal for bahamians all ages
how marcell can you compare a crime that is clearly illegal for all with an activity that is legal for some solely because of their age and immigrant status while on the other hand illegal for others because of their immigrant status regardless of their age?
either you allow all adults 18 years and older to gamble straight across the board in the bahamas as tourists 18 and older presently do or you don’t straight across the board and which government do you really think will shut down the casinos over pi, cable beach, exuma, bimini! really?
On Web shops and gambling
Posted 9 January 2014, 2:24 p.m. Suggest removal
ChrisRolle says...
As it relates to everyone else reading this:
1) Bahamians, you did not vote to Legalize Web Shop Gaming, you did not! you voted to either have the Web Shops Taxed” & to be “Regularized” which means to conform as one eg Same Pay Outs, same games offered, same uniforms, same policies etc.
You instead said no Government, we do not want you to tax the webshops, we want them to operate tax free which is the reason why they will not have to pay value added tax (vat) and you also said not government, we want the web shop owners to decide as they please what their payouts can be, what their own policies can be, they do not need to have union representation, they can operate at what ever hours they please, they can make their own policies whereas the casino have to all act on one accord, that’s what you voted no for!
2) Do you really think the Webshops want to be taxed? Really?
3) Do you really think the Webshops want to be “Regularized” and not have the 100% freedom which they presently do to decide on their own what their terms, conditions & payouts would be as they please? Really?
4) Fact, the Webshop owners wanted the “No” vote and those who were all around town promoting a “No” vote did exactly what the web shop owners wanted them to do whether they realized it or not because again, who in their right mind would not want to have the freedom to run their business as they please and most importantly, which business owner would want to be taxed?
Bahamians, wake up, educate yourself, the Government wanted the “Yes” vote, the webshop owners wanted the “No” vote.
Why?
Obtaining a license to open up a Web Shop is presently legal!
Any business with a license can allow their customers to open an account for debits/credits!
What happens online in ca, il, ny, fl, la, Isle of Man or any country outside the Bahamas cannot be policed by Bahamian authorities but rather only by the authorities in those locations the same way those authorities have no jurisdiction in the Bahamas.
If I as a business owner said:
Hey Rory, since you have an online account in my business with $10, tonight if the Miami Heat scores 109 and the New Orleans Pelicans score five points or higher (114 points or higher), I will give you $50 but if New Orleans scores 113 or less, I will keep your money, how can the Police arrest me and/or you Rory?
On Christian community is ‘divided over gambling’
Posted 7 January 2014, 2:36 p.m. Suggest removal
ChrisRolle says...
bahamapride, excellent feedback. As it relates to you below statement:
The webb shop owners are in violation of the laws!
Notice what you said, not the illegal analog casino with slot machines, tables with dealers that are not approved by the gaming board, you said:
The webb shop owners are in violation of the laws
Do you really want to know why 39 newly register Web Shop licenses in New Providence alone have been approved during the past year after the non-Constitutional Opinion Poll where many people incorrectly call a Referendum?
There is no law in the Bahamas Lottery & Gaming Act Chaper 387 that address gaming online aka web shop gambling.
Until such time therein, the Police Commissioner, the Attorney General and the Courts cannot arrest/charge/convict any Bahamian or Tourist on a crime in which there is no law to arrest/charge/convict them with.
That is fact.
The present attorney’s who are aware of this fact that are presently representing the web shop owners in court know they have a clear cut case because like them, myself and many others who fully read and understand the Lottery & Gaming Act know this.
At the end of the day, until a law is created to directly address Internet Gaming in the Bahamas, we will continue to remain in this conundrum.
On Christian community is ‘divided over gambling’
Posted 7 January 2014, 2:25 p.m. Suggest removal