The death penalty referendum is another red herring designed to distract the public. Capital punishment will have no impact on our crime problem one way or the other. We currently face a two-pronged problem - the first issue is hardened criminals killing or being killed while on bail. As DonAnthony said, we have to give them bail because we hold them for 3-4 years without trial, because our judicial system is ossified and broken. So, these fellas know they will see the street again before anyone has a chance to convict and sentence, much less hang them. They will either kill again or be killed before they have even cause to think about an ultimate punishment down the line. Most don't expect to live past a few years, so how you gonna scare them with the threat of a noose a decade away, once all at the appeals an etc are done? The other issue of the two pronged situation we face, is the masses of young boys 13-17 years old who have no parental figures and look up to the drug dealer on the corner and try to emulate his lifestyle. Now, I don't know about you guys, but I remember that as a 13 year old boy, I was invincible in my own head. No threat of some far away punishment could touch me. It is simply nonsense to expect a rational and responsible weighing of "calculated risk" for an action from an adolescent boy. If capital punishment is a deterrent anywhere in the world (i will leave that to the experts) it can only be in places where justice is swift and punishment comes quickly. It will have zero impact on the mental state of the problem groups in the Bahamas, so long as our judicial system moves at the agonizing crawl which it currently does.
@mangogirl011 - this was printed today - as up to date as they come. http://www.tribune242.com/news/2014/dec… I understand the frustration that many in this society feel, but we have to be very careful HOW we do what we do.
mangogirl011 - I only wish things had changed in the last 10 years. I can't repeat it all, but in case you didn't see and have time and are interested, the salient points of the argument are in the comments section of these two earlier stories:
@duppyVAT - all versions of the "if this place so bad, why you here?" argument are a tacit admission of defeat. A statement about a country is either true or it is false – people's decision to stay in/leave said country have zero bearing whatsoever on the facts as they are.
Emac - Comparing the Bahamas to Haiti is nothing but deflection, we are responsible for our own actions regardless of how other nations behave. I don't indulge in that kind of comparison because it is a red herring, a dodge meant to cast our deeds in a better light than they should be. When the police come to arrest me for stealing I can't get off by saying "Well my neighbor is a murderer." One has nothing to do with the other. I am a Bahamian and am concerned with what we do. Full stop. And I don't know about countries around the world fighting battles against illegal Haitians; I do know how the Dominican Republic is handling it, and they are getting destroyed in the international press. I would say this: to the extent that any country disregards fundamental rights and freedoms as part of the "fight" which you reference, then I think they should definitely be chastised. Finally, this business of 'go back and help build your country' is nothing but a convenient fantasy with which we make ourselves feel better. Haiti is failing on a massive scale, through no fault of any individual Haitian living in the Bahamas, and when sent back, there is nothing they can do about it but go there and die, and watch their children do so as well. YES. We do have to send illegals back for the future of our own country, but don't tell yourself bedtime stories so you could sleep at night. Be big enough to accept the consequences of you factions - we make the choice to send them back to suffer a brutal, pointless and probably short life. I have no problem with choosing my children over their own, but I do it with a heavy heart and at least try to man up to the realities.
Emac - Comparing the Bahamas to Haiti is nothing but deflection, we are responsible for our own actions regardless of how other nations behave. I don't indulge in that kind of comparison because it is a red herring, a dodge meant to cast our deeds in a better light than they should be. When the police come to arrest me for stealing I can't get off by saying "Well my neighbor is a murderer." One has nothing to do with the other. I am a Bahamian and am concerned with what we do. Full stop. And I don't know about countries around the world fighting battles against illegal Haitians; I do know how the Dominican Republic is handling it, and they are getting destroyed in the international press. I would say this: to the extent that any country disregards fundamental rights and freedoms as part of the "fight" which you reference, then I think they should definitely be chastised. Finally, this business of 'go back and help build your country' is nothing but a convenient fantasy with which we make ourselves feel better. Haiti is failing on a massive scale, through no fault of any individual Haitian living in the Bahamas, and when sent back, there is nothing they can do about it but go there and die, and watch their children do so as well. YES. We do have to send illegals back for the future of our own country, but don't tell yourself bedtime stories so you could sleep at night. Be big enough to accept the consequences of you factions - we make the choice to send them back to suffer a brutal, pointless and probably short life. I have no problem with choosing my children over their own, but I do it with a heavy heart and at least try to man up to the realities.
Voltaire says...
The death penalty referendum is another red herring designed to distract the public. Capital punishment will have no impact on our crime problem one way or the other. We currently face a two-pronged problem - the first issue is hardened criminals killing or being killed while on bail. As DonAnthony said, we have to give them bail because we hold them for 3-4 years without trial, because our judicial system is ossified and broken. So, these fellas know they will see the street again before anyone has a chance to convict and sentence, much less hang them. They will either kill again or be killed before they have even cause to think about an ultimate punishment down the line. Most don't expect to live past a few years, so how you gonna scare them with the threat of a noose a decade away, once all at the appeals an etc are done? The other issue of the two pronged situation we face, is the masses of young boys 13-17 years old who have no parental figures and look up to the drug dealer on the corner and try to emulate his lifestyle. Now, I don't know about you guys, but I remember that as a 13 year old boy, I was invincible in my own head. No threat of some far away punishment could touch me. It is simply nonsense to expect a rational and responsible weighing of "calculated risk" for an action from an adolescent boy. If capital punishment is a deterrent anywhere in the world (i will leave that to the experts) it can only be in places where justice is swift and punishment comes quickly. It will have zero impact on the mental state of the problem groups in the Bahamas, so long as our judicial system moves at the agonizing crawl which it currently does.
On FNM leader: Christie administration 'paralysed' in the face of crime
Posted 8 December 2014, 2:40 p.m. Suggest removal
Voltaire says...
Not a bad idea...
On QC demands new Port ownership
Posted 8 December 2014, 2:28 p.m. Suggest removal
Voltaire says...
@mangogirl011 - this was printed today - as up to date as they come. http://www.tribune242.com/news/2014/dec…
I understand the frustration that many in this society feel, but we have to be very careful HOW we do what we do.
On Probe of 'abuse' by Immigration
Posted 8 December 2014, 1:17 p.m. Suggest removal
Voltaire says...
mangogirl011 - I only wish things had changed in the last 10 years. I can't repeat it all, but in case you didn't see and have time and are interested, the salient points of the argument are in the comments section of these two earlier stories:
http://www.tribune242.com/news/2014/dec…
http://www.tribune242.com/news/2014/dec…
On Probe of 'abuse' by Immigration
Posted 8 December 2014, 1:15 p.m. Suggest removal
Voltaire says...
I say this - lets dust off our mirror and have a look at ourselves: http://avalon.law.yale.edu/diana/haitib…
On Probe of 'abuse' by Immigration
Posted 8 December 2014, 11:29 a.m. Suggest removal
Voltaire says...
@duppyVAT - all versions of the "if this place so bad, why you here?" argument are a tacit admission of defeat. A statement about a country is either true or it is false – people's decision to stay in/leave said country have zero bearing whatsoever on the facts as they are.
On Children 'left hungry and slept on floor' at Detention Centre
Posted 8 December 2014, 9:32 a.m. Suggest removal
Voltaire says...
Emac - Comparing the Bahamas to Haiti is nothing but deflection, we are responsible for our own actions regardless of how other nations behave. I don't indulge in that kind of comparison because it is a red herring, a dodge meant to cast our deeds in a better light than they should be. When the police come to arrest me for stealing I can't get off by saying "Well my neighbor is a murderer." One has nothing to do with the other. I am a Bahamian and am concerned with what we do. Full stop. And I don't know about countries around the world fighting battles against illegal Haitians; I do know how the Dominican Republic is handling it, and they are getting destroyed in the international press. I would say this: to the extent that any country disregards fundamental rights and freedoms as part of the "fight" which you reference, then I think they should definitely be chastised. Finally, this business of 'go back and help build your country' is nothing but a convenient fantasy with which we make ourselves feel better. Haiti is failing on a massive scale, through no fault of any individual Haitian living in the Bahamas, and when sent back, there is nothing they can do about it but go there and die, and watch their children do so as well. YES. We do have to send illegals back for the future of our own country, but don't tell yourself bedtime stories so you could sleep at night. Be big enough to accept the consequences of you factions - we make the choice to send them back to suffer a brutal, pointless and probably short life. I have no problem with choosing my children over their own, but I do it with a heavy heart and at least try to man up to the realities.
On Children 'left hungry and slept on floor' at Detention Centre
Posted 8 December 2014, 9:27 a.m. Suggest removal
Voltaire says...
Emac - Comparing the Bahamas to Haiti is nothing but deflection, we are responsible for our own actions regardless of how other nations behave. I don't indulge in that kind of comparison because it is a red herring, a dodge meant to cast our deeds in a better light than they should be. When the police come to arrest me for stealing I can't get off by saying "Well my neighbor is a murderer." One has nothing to do with the other. I am a Bahamian and am concerned with what we do. Full stop. And I don't know about countries around the world fighting battles against illegal Haitians; I do know how the Dominican Republic is handling it, and they are getting destroyed in the international press. I would say this: to the extent that any country disregards fundamental rights and freedoms as part of the "fight" which you reference, then I think they should definitely be chastised. Finally, this business of 'go back and help build your country' is nothing but a convenient fantasy with which we make ourselves feel better. Haiti is failing on a massive scale, through no fault of any individual Haitian living in the Bahamas, and when sent back, there is nothing they can do about it but go there and die, and watch their children do so as well. YES. We do have to send illegals back for the future of our own country, but don't tell yourself bedtime stories so you could sleep at night. Be big enough to accept the consequences of you factions - we make the choice to send them back to suffer a brutal, pointless and probably short life. I have no problem with choosing my children over their own, but I do it with a heavy heart and at least try to man up to the realities.
On Bahamian-born woman accuses immigration staff of assault
Posted 8 December 2014, 9:14 a.m. Suggest removal
Voltaire says...
How many out of 14 would you give us? - http://www.rense.com/general37/char.htm
On Bahamian-born woman accuses immigration staff of assault
Posted 8 December 2014, 7:28 a.m. Suggest removal
Voltaire says...
How many out of 14 would you give us? - http://www.rense.com/general37/char.htm
On Children 'left hungry and slept on floor' at Detention Centre
Posted 8 December 2014, 7:27 a.m. Suggest removal